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Post by Wagner1 on Jan 6, 2005 14:10:17 GMT -5
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Post by Jimmy21 on Jan 6, 2005 16:19:25 GMT -5
Here is the article.
NHL in the ’Peg not such a crazy notion
Ed Willes
WINNIPEG Things were so much different when the NHL ripped the heart out of this city nine years ago. Then, there wasn’t a new 15,015-seat arena in Winnipeg, complete with all the modern conveniences. Then, the NHL wasn’t trying to ram a $31-million salary cap down the NHLPA’s throat. Then, there weren’t half a dozen NHL franchises on life support. No, when the NHL left Winnipeg in the spring of ’96 the belief was it had simply outgrown this frigid outpost on the Canadian prairie. It hurt like hell at the time. To a certain extent, the city still isn’t over it. But love is also a tricky thing — just ask Jennifer Lopez — and if Gary Bettman ever showed a bit of interest in Winnipeg again, they’d forget all that pain in a hurry. Maybe they wouldn’t fall back into the NHL’s arms immediately. But, at the very least, they’d be willing to start dating again. “We didn’t [build the glittering MTS Centre] to jump up the queue for the NHL,” said Mark Chipman, the 44-year-old owner of the Manitoba Moose who endured the Jets’ tortured journey every step of the way. “But we didn’t rule it out either. I think the league knows we’re here. If anyone wants to come look under the hood, we’d talk to them.” But they’re not going to give their heart away as easily this time. The notion of the NHL returning to Winnipeg, of course, is wildly fanciful but there’s also been enough change in the league’s and the city’s landscape to at least raise the question: What if? What if the NHL returns with a $31-million hard cap? What if franchises in Nashville, Atlanta, Phoenix, etc., etc., don’t survive this lockout? What if the big money in Winnipeg decides the NHL isn’t a bad idea after all? At this point, they’re just questions. But the point is you can ask them without sounding like a complete idiot and that hasn’t always been the case in Winnipeg. “I’m not actively pursuing [the NHL],” said Chipman. “But I’m interested to see the extent to which they get it fixed.” A decade ago he was also interested. The problem was the NHL wasn’t very interested in Winnipeg. Its rink was hopelessly out of date. Several well-intentioned but underfunded local initiatives failed to deliver a new one. The city’s fans believed their irrational passion for the game was enough to sustain the Jets. But it wasn’t. In the last year of their existence, under admittedly difficult circumstances, the Jets’ payroll was $17 million US, the average ticket price was $26 and they lost $25 million. Now, the market, to borrow a phrase currently in vogue, is what it is. Winnipeg’s population is about 700,000. The corporate base is limited. There is an intensely rabid fan base but there’s a question about its ability to pay NHL prices. Yet, the dream persists. The new MTS Centre is the city’s centrepiece and it is an NHLcalibre building. The 50 luxury boxes were leased to some 90 local businesses. The AHL Moose, who weren’t exactly embraced by Winnipeggers when they replaced the Jets, now boast 5,500 season tickets and average just under 9,000 fans per game. True, it might be missing a couple of thousand seats for the NHL’s liking but it’s as if Winnipeg is saying, this is what we’ve got. If it’s enough for your league, fine. If it’s not, that’s fine, too. “Clearly, a large number of hockey fans are following what’s going on now and I’m one of them,” said Chipman. “We’d need some help. Thirty-one million doesn’t work for a lot of markets. I’m not sure it works for Edmonton. “But the question is, is this a better hockey market than some of the existing ones in the NHL and the answer is, absolutely.” Actually, hockey was never the question. And maybe one day that’s all that will matter. ewilles@png.canwest.com
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Post by jamiebez on Jan 6, 2005 16:56:16 GMT -5
A good article. Honest, if maybe a touch too negative.
Ed Willes used to write for the Winnipeg Sun, no?
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Post by Big Chris in Japan on Jan 7, 2005 1:04:08 GMT -5
This article shows that chipman is simply NOT on board with us. More fuel to the buyout fire. Also, Willis is writing to readers in Vancouver, a city that has always been dead set against Winnipeg's very existance. You didn't expect him to sing our praises did you?
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Post by icecoldian on Jan 7, 2005 2:12:21 GMT -5
very real article, i would agree a lil negative at times, but still good, and real. I notice the e-mail is CanWest... is it possible David Asper had a little Jets artice quota he wanted a writer to meet... checking in on the public's thoughts regarding the Jets. I say we e-mail him with a little "good article, can't wait until they come back" style... I am going to e-mail him!
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Post by Other on Jan 7, 2005 14:42:33 GMT -5
very real article, i would agree a lil negative at times, but still good, and real. I notice the e-mail is CanWest... is it possible David Asper had a little Jets artice quota he wanted a writer to meet... checking in on the public's thoughts regarding the Jets. I say we e-mail him with a little "good article, can't wait until they come back" style... I am going to e-mail him! I work in the Canwest company, I'd highly doubt either of the Aspers would make a quota on writing about the Jets. If you look at the articles he wrote he was covering the World Juniors, the fact there were so many Jets jerseys and Go Jets Go and Winnipegers down there is what would have made him write that article.
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Post by Darren Ford on Jan 7, 2005 15:00:38 GMT -5
Look for the article in the "Press" section soon.
- DF
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Post by dreamcatcher on Jan 7, 2005 15:58:53 GMT -5
I do not see where everyone finds this article a touch negative. I would say it is 100 percent realistic, and has simply left out our enthusiasm here at Jetsowner regarding the logistics required to make the NHL work here. As for Mark Chipman? It is simply a realistic approach taken to the potential for the return of the NHL. His stance is business-like, with quotes such as " If anyone wants to come look under the hood, we'd talk to them." How SHOULD Mark sound? Desperate? Would that be in the best interests of this campaign? Should Mark, and other businessmen lay all their cards out on the table right now, before the CBA is resolved? Now, I am not berrating anyone, nor am I defending Mark Chipman. What I AM saying is this: Winnipeg business, is not going to go out there and look desperate for an NHL Team. In fact, it is going to appear non-chalant, and perhaps only mildly interested. When you purchase a car, or something of value, do you negotiate prices, or act excited and jump when opportunity arises? That's really the only point here. I suspect that Winnipeg business, although extremely interested in bringing the NHL back here, will NOT scramble around to get a franchise, but will wait patiently, and feel out the Post-NHL market place.
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Post by Realistic on Jan 7, 2005 16:44:18 GMT -5
Who stands a better chance at landing a relocating NHL team?
Winnipeg and Mark Chipman who say:
"We're not actively pursuing an NHL team." "The MTS Centre wasn't built to attract an NHL team." "If someone came to us, we'll listen."
OR
Investors from Houston, Kansas City, Portland, and Oklahoma City, who have venues designed for NHL hockey and have people who are saying "We want an NHL team here." and who ARE actively pursuing an NHL team?
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Post by Jimmy21 on Jan 7, 2005 18:05:55 GMT -5
If Investors From Houston, Kansas City, Portland and Oklahoma City who have their NHL ready arenas are saying they want an NHL team, why are they not pursuing one of the teams currently on the sales block?
Can it possibly be, because they are waiting for the outcome of the lockout, or is it because they are not currently pursuing a team at all. You seem to have the answers to this. I'd like for you to tell me who these so called Investors in these cities are. Please, share their names with me.
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Post by Jimmy21 on Jan 7, 2005 18:22:54 GMT -5
I take this article as being nothing but positive. A year ago, nobody in the Vancouver press was writing ariticles about the Jets return. The other day, the Vancouver Province posted this article. This is a big step forward. As for Mark Chipman, he is taking a solid business approach to the questions asked of him in this article. If the Jets are to return to Winnipeg, it will take a some real business savvy to accomplish the task. These are traits that Mark Chipman possess.
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Post by jamiebez on Jan 7, 2005 18:29:54 GMT -5
Who stands a better chance at landing a relocating NHL team? Winnipeg and Mark Chipman who say: "We're not actively pursuing an NHL team." "The MTS Centre wasn't built to attract an NHL team." "If someone came to us, we'll listen." OR Investors from Houston, Kansas City, Portland, and Oklahoma City, who have venues designed for NHL hockey and have people who are saying "We want an NHL team here." and who ARE actively pursuing an NHL team? Your point is valid, but dude, you're missing the whole point of this site. The site name is jets OWNER.com, not bringbackthejets.com, for a reason: we're all trying to attract the attention of a potential owner by showing him that we, as fans, are excited about bringing the Jets back. Maybe Chipman's the guy, maybe not, but the point is: we're searching for the person who WILL say "We want an NHL team here AND we have the $$$ to do it, so follow me!". And Jimmy is right... if Houston, KC, etc have these rich investors chomping at the bit, why didn't they buy the Sabres or Senators when they went bankrupt and could be had for a song?
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Post by Jimmy21 on Jan 7, 2005 21:47:41 GMT -5
Hey jamiebez I understand your point. I'm with you!
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Post by King Hutt on Jan 7, 2005 23:10:35 GMT -5
That article is nothing but great for the cause. And I was surprised by how open Chipman sounded to the NHL. Some of you guys just want puff pieces.
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Post by King Hutt on Jan 7, 2005 23:11:15 GMT -5
BTW, it also ran today in the Nat Post, with a big honking pic of MTS Centre.
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Post by Big Chris in Japan on Jan 8, 2005 22:42:30 GMT -5
I am amazed at just how starry eyed people can be about chipman. Do you know what he did by saying he wasn't interested in the NHL? He took us OFF the market for an NHL team.
To those of you who think this was "saavy" or "great strategy", give your heads a shake. Were you the same people who said "Barry Shankerow would NEVER sell the Jets."? Open your eyes and see this man for what he really is. He has no interest in bringing the NHL back here or even supporting it's return. He locked the WHL out of here after stating to the Mayor that they were more than welcome. Now he clearly prepared to block or simply ignore any thought of the NHL returning here.
Cities that come out and say they WANT a team and have the money almost always do. (See St. Louis with the NFL, Memphis and Orlando in the NBA and Nashville with the NHL and NFL for a reference.) The cities that "aren't interested at this time". Don't get a team, period. (See Portland, Seattle and Cincinatti for a reference in terms of getting an NHL team.)
The answer is simple: Boycott the Moose and everything else chipman owns here. Saying he wants to see the NHL back here or is persuing the concept isn't "looking desperate". Saying you are interested will just get more people knocking on our door as so many teams are available at bargain basement prices. It's a buyer's market and since chipman doesn't realize this, he is a fool.
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Post by Ducky on Jan 9, 2005 3:09:02 GMT -5
Hey Chris I am not dismisssing your theory but could it be that it would be premature for him to make a stance on getting an NHL team here when there is a possibility there could be no NHL in years to come. And also it would also be suicide for him to say he wants the Jets more than the Moose. First he has to keep his moose fans happy for now and make sure he has money come-in to pay for the MTSC. If he announces he intentions right now on getting the Jets his attendance may drop.
I know you are right that he is very comfortable in making a guaranteed profit with having the moose and he can keep the profits for himself; if he he were a partner in ownership for the Jets he would make a smaller profit. I think.
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Post by Big Chris in Japan on Jan 9, 2005 4:30:08 GMT -5
Hey Chris I am not dismisssing your theory but could it be that it would be premature for him to make a stance on getting an NHL team here when there is a possibility there could be no NHL in years to come. And also it would also be suicide for him to say he wants the Jets more than the Moose. First he has to keep his moose fans happy for now and make sure he has money come-in to pay for the MTSC. If he announces he intentions right now on getting the Jets his attendance may drop. Attendance will drop a lot further if he continues his anti-NHL stance. He has made it clear, the NHL does NOT at all interest him. We need to send a message that this isn't acceptable. Again, people who say they are not interested pubilcally get passed over. Do you really think Bettman is going to recommend Winnipeg with the biggest player of all in this has said no to the NHL? Owners are going to start crossing Winnipeg off of their list as long as chipman continues to fight against the return of the NHL here. If fans start to stay away he won't make any profit at all. I still feel that a buyout is the only way to get rid of chipman. Any other solution will be worse than WEC was and a chipman led group would be a ticket to last place oblivion just like the moose in the last decade. The chipman strategy is simple, it is easy to make more money off a loser than a winner if you shaft the right people. He is not a hockey fan and has no passion or committment to anything but collecting his big fat paycheck from the scrubs in vancouver.
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Post by USApegger on Jan 9, 2005 4:40:40 GMT -5
I have been reading all these Anti USA NHL posts for a long time, yet it makes me wonder, the original 6 had 4 US teams and two Canadian teams, yes for sure there are teams in the States that shouldn't belong there(Florida, Atlanta, Nashville, perhaps Phoenix and the Ducks), yes Pittsburgh was in bankrucptcy, but then again so was Ottawa and yet again Buffalo. I also understand what the NHL was trying to do when they expanded to these markets (expansion dollars for the rest of the league) If I remember correctly after the Molson boycott in 1979 which hit Montreal hard ( if I am correct either some bullets were put through a door in Winnipeg at molson's or someone was shot and then Fergie banned Molsons from the barn) the Jets paid 6 million to join the NHL, along with the other three, which took the league up to 21 teams, yet they were there for the future expansions and had a share in those revenues up until the Jets moved. What happened to that money that the Jets received? Also I think the only reason why Edmonton has survived to this point is because of the 80's Oilers teams. I am an American and am really tired of it being all our fault for what is wrong nowadays. Let's not forget that the US franchises supported the Canadian franchise when the Canadian dollar was weak and with the old TV contract with ESPN and ABC there was way more money $600 million per year (in US dollars) that was spread around. The US is not your enemy, the fans down here miss hockey as much as you and almost everyone I speak to about the RTJ thinks it should happen. The anti USA comments at the World Juniors have really bothered me. From what I understand they were really good hosts and the tourney would not have been a success without the Manitoban support. Sorry that's my rant, I would much rather go to the peg for a game than the cities, but the cities is my only choice. Cheers, Ian MacLeod Bemidji, MN
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Post by USApegger on Jan 9, 2005 4:42:12 GMT -5
I forgot to put Carolina in my post as one of the teams that shouldn't be there.
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