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Post by matrix on Jun 3, 2011 11:38:15 GMT -5
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Post by shtinky on Jun 3, 2011 13:27:33 GMT -5
Colisee would be a great temporary home for the Nords for a few years while a new rink gets built. I'm not surprised that it would not cost very much to get it NHL ready.
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Post by ReJ40 on Jun 3, 2011 14:32:45 GMT -5
I really really hope Phoenix ends up there next season...
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Post by postmanpat on Jun 3, 2011 19:53:50 GMT -5
As Bettman has said, a potential NHL market needs an arena and an ownership group. If the Colisée is NHL ready then Quebec City has both for the inevitable point when Glendale decides to stop it's annual conflagration of taxpayer money.
I'm willing to say that we may see the Quebec Nordiques as early as next May.
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Post by bcrt2000 on Jun 4, 2011 19:44:20 GMT -5
Its critical that the people in Quebec pulling for an NHL team get funding ready for a new arena + prepare plans to renovate the Colisee for a team to come in and play there for the 2012-13 and 2013-14 seasons until the new arena is built. The Coyotes will be there for the picking and unless someone in the US want to pay a crazy amount of money for a team, Quebec will be the #1 choice with those plans in place.
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Post by matrix on Jun 21, 2011 6:51:42 GMT -5
Yesterday, the city approved renovation in the Colisée.
2.5 millions until fall 2012
and another 2.5 millions for 2013
Why would the city put so much money in this building if the new one should be ready for 2015 ?
Maybe the city want to make a kind of statement to the league.
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Post by shtinky on Jun 21, 2011 9:03:11 GMT -5
^ For such a big and old arena, $5 million is probably not much more than routine maintenance and minor upgrades that they need to do to keep the Colisee functional.
As I recall, the old Winnipeg Arena (which was in a similar situation) received a bunch of upgrades before the 1999 Pan Am Games. By fall 2004, it was closed down for good.
The NHL knows that an arena will not be an issue in Quebec if it decides to send the Coyotes there... a couple of seasons in the Colisee will be no problem while a new arena gets built.
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Post by matrix on Jun 21, 2011 10:21:04 GMT -5
^ For such a big and old arena, $5 million is probably not much more than routine maintenance and minor upgrades that they need to do to keep the Colisee functional. As I recall, the old Winnipeg Arena (which was in a similar situation) received a bunch of upgrades before the 1999 Pan Am Games. By fall 2004, it was closed down for good. The NHL knows that an arena will not be an issue in Quebec if it decides to send the Coyotes there... a couple of seasons in the Colisee will be no problem while a new arena gets built. good point, However, it's not only minor things...According to this article : lejournaldequebec.canoe.ca/journaldequebec/actualites/quebec/archives/2011/06/20110620-231421.htmlIt's more about upgrading the building up to the NHL standard |
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Post by jetsnnordiquesfan on Jun 21, 2011 14:44:53 GMT -5
Note: even if the NHL was to never return and that there were no new arena project, the Colisée would still need upgrades anyway. The Remparts, for example, planned to host the memorial cup in 2015, and sometimes in Quebec we have weather close to 30°C with humidity in May. I have doubts that a game at the Colisée could be played when it's 30°C inside. (Or maybe it could, but then I have memories of that one Boston Garden game in 1988)
Plus the boards are dangerous, even for junior hockey.
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johnd
Veteran Member
Thank you TNSE!
Posts: 228
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Post by johnd on Jun 22, 2011 9:27:06 GMT -5
If there's an agreement for shovels in the ground by the end of 2011, including a signed contract for renovations to be completed by July 2012, we'll probably see an accouncement of the Coyotes moving by May 2012.
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xman
Prime Member
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Post by xman on Jun 25, 2011 4:07:06 GMT -5
Re: The return of the Nordiques, FWIW NHL Network keeps airing an ad spot about the Stastny brothers  |
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Post by ronjeremy on Jun 25, 2011 10:21:07 GMT -5
They should start seriously to build the arena, cos the Coyotes are doomed next season...
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Post by CravenMoorhead on Jun 25, 2011 17:32:06 GMT -5
Absolutely.
Do whatever it takes to get that thing built by summer of 2015. There is no way that the Coyotes are going to stay in Arizona. The franchise is yours if an owner with big pockets and a desire to build an arena steps up to the plate.
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Post by stbvoyageur on Jun 25, 2011 22:27:22 GMT -5
Absolutely. Do whatever it takes to get that thing built by summer of 2015. There is no way that the Coyotes are going to stay in Arizona. The franchise is yours if an owner with big pockets and a desire to build an arena steps up to the plate. While I agree that the Coyotes are doomed, I am less than convinced they will be moved to Québec. Detroit and Columbus are pushing to move East, moving Phoenix east impedes this. Ken Holland has significant influence with the BoG, and he will not be alone. If you are Toronto would you rather have a team in Québec, or Detroit in your division, if your Buffalo? All the teams in the East would gain in attendance (revenue) with Detroit in their Conference, that is important, especially if comes down to a vote. I think Québec should keep their sites on the Isles, that is more sensible to me, no new arena & Charles Wang will sell...If any legit owner pops up in Seattle, Houston, Kansas City, Milwaukee or even Vegas they will get first dibs on the Coyotes carcass. I would rather have the Isles anyway, they have a chance to win with good management... I'm still not sure that the NHL will allow a team to play in the Colisée, the upgrades do not concern box seats, which is the big revenue maker, the Colisée is rather antiquated, and it is in the middle of a residential neighbourhood in Québec. Their fortune might be that another team's owner wants out as bad as the Atlanta Spirit, however Hamilton, with Basilles money, and Hartford, with the Baldwins, will be tough competition. |
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Post by CravenMoorhead on Jun 25, 2011 23:50:08 GMT -5
Absolutely. Do whatever it takes to get that thing built by summer of 2015. There is no way that the Coyotes are going to stay in Arizona. The franchise is yours if an owner with big pockets and a desire to build an arena steps up to the plate. While I agree that the Coyotes are doomed, I am less than convinced they will be moved to Québec. Detroit and Columbus are pushing to move East, moving Phoenix east impedes this. Ken Holland has significant influence with the BoG, and he will not be alone. If you are Toronto would you rather have a team in Québec, or Detroit in your division, if your Buffalo? All the teams in the East would gain in attendance (revenue) with Detroit in their Conference, that is important, especially if comes down to a vote. I think Québec should keep their sites on the Isles, that is more sensible to me, no new arena & Charles Wang will sell...If any legit owner pops up in Seattle, Houston, Kansas City, Milwaukee or even Vegas they will get first dibs on the Coyotes carcass. I would rather have the Isles anyway, they have a chance to win with good management... I'm still not sure that the NHL will allow a team to play in the Colisée, the upgrades do not concern box seats, which is the big revenue maker, the Colisée is rather antiquated, and it is in the middle of a residential neighbourhood in Québec. Their fortune might be that another team's owner wants out as bad as the Atlanta Spirit, however Hamilton, with Basilles money, and Hartford, with the Baldwins, will be tough competition. all I can say is money talks and BS walks. If the Quebec owners come up with the money, the franchise is gone. Period. No NHL owner in their right mind will want to incur another year of losses in Arizona, and all signs point to the losses being well over $25 million. |
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Post by mikecubs on Jun 26, 2011 2:45:55 GMT -5
As Bettman has said, a potential NHL market needs an arena and an ownership group. If the Colisée is NHL ready then Quebec City has both for the inevitable point when Glendale decides to stop it's annual conflagration of taxpayer money. I'm willing to say that we may see the Quebec Nordiques as early as next May. You've taken Bettmans comments out of context. When he said that an arena was needed he meant a new arena 100% approved. Not any maybe we will work on it and hope for the best. If a new arena was approved they for sure would play a couple years at the Colisee. But no way do they go to Quebec City without the project approved. |
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Post by mikecubs on Jun 26, 2011 2:54:45 GMT -5
Absolutely. Do whatever it takes to get that thing built by summer of 2015. There is no way that the Coyotes are going to stay in Arizona. The franchise is yours if an owner with big pockets and a desire to build an arena steps up to the plate. While I agree that the Coyotes are doomed, I am less than convinced they will be moved to Québec. Detroit and Columbus are pushing to move East, moving Phoenix east impedes this. Ken Holland has significant influence with the BoG, and he will not be alone. If you are Toronto would you rather have a team in Québec, or Detroit in your division, if your Buffalo? All the teams in the East would gain in attendance (revenue) with Detroit in their Conference, that is important, especially if comes down to a vote. I think Québec should keep their sites on the Isles, that is more sensible to me, no new arena & Charles Wang will sell...If any legit owner pops up in Seattle, Houston, Kansas City, Milwaukee or even Vegas they will get first dibs on the Coyotes carcass. I would rather have the Isles anyway, they have a chance to win with good management... I'm still not sure that the NHL will allow a team to play in the Colisée, the upgrades do not concern box seats, which is the big revenue maker, the Colisée is rather antiquated, and it is in the middle of a residential neighbourhood in Québec. Their fortune might be that another team's owner wants out as bad as the Atlanta Spirit, however Hamilton, with Basilles money, and Hartford, with the Baldwins, will be tough competition. Realignment will not be a factor. Bettman will pick the best market period. Seattle has no chance whatso ever. They have no arena and no hopes of getting one approved for at least 10 years. Vegas has no arena and no hopes of getting one. Milwaukee has no arena. The Bradley Center is outdated. The Milwaukee Bucks want a new one. Milwaukee has only 1.5 Million people. No city under 2 million people has 3 teams in any sport. Plus they would have to compete with the Green Bay packers. I live in Wisconsin. There is 0 talk or chance of this happening. Kabul, Afganistan has just as good a shot as Milwaukee getting a team. Hartford has no arena and will not be getting one. The city is in awful financial shape. Hamilton isn't ever happening. A team in Hamilton would kill the Buffalo Sabres and put them out of business. Other than Winnipeg Buffalo is the smallest market in the league and the city population is actually declining. Buffalo is in awful financial shape being a rust belt city. By putting a team in Hamilton all you would be doing is helping one team and killing another. You'd be back to square one. Houston and Kansas city have the arenas to suport a team. However if a team went to KC it would be the smallest 3 team market team in the country. Houston has the size but would not have the interest. Quebec City would be the choice unless they screw up building a new arena. After seeing the total sucess story of Winnipeg selling out in 2 minutes Quebec City is the 1st choice. Bettman may not be the brightest but no way would he pick KC or Houston over QC. |
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Post by iliketherangers on Jun 26, 2011 12:40:15 GMT -5
^^^great post! I definetely think QC is next to get the coyoytes. I don't even think anymore the panthers will move, and that hamiton will get a team. You made some great points about hamilton!
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Post by stbvoyageur on Jun 26, 2011 13:14:17 GMT -5
While I agree that the Coyotes are doomed, I am less than convinced they will be moved to Québec. Detroit and Columbus are pushing to move East, moving Phoenix east impedes this. Ken Holland has significant influence with the BoG, and he will not be alone. If you are Toronto would you rather have a team in Québec, or Detroit in your division, if your Buffalo? All the teams in the East would gain in attendance (revenue) with Detroit in their Conference, that is important, especially if comes down to a vote. I think Québec should keep their sites on the Isles, that is more sensible to me, no new arena & Charles Wang will sell...If any legit owner pops up in Seattle, Houston, Kansas City, Milwaukee or even Vegas they will get first dibs on the Coyotes carcass. I would rather have the Isles anyway, they have a chance to win with good management... I'm still not sure that the NHL will allow a team to play in the Colisée, the upgrades do not concern box seats, which is the big revenue maker, the Colisée is rather antiquated, and it is in the middle of a residential neighbourhood in Québec. Their fortune might be that another team's owner wants out as bad as the Atlanta Spirit, however Hamilton, with Basilles money, and Hartford, with the Baldwins, will be tough competition. Realignment will not be a factor. Bettman will pick the best market period. Seattle has no chance whatso ever. They have no arena and no hopes of getting one approved for at least 10 years. Vegas has no arena and no hopes of getting one. Milwaukee has no arena. The Bradley Center is outdated. The Milwaukee Bucks want a new one. Milwaukee has only 1.5 Million people. No city under 2 million people has 3 teams in any sport. Plus they would have to compete with the Green Bay packers. I live in Wisconsin. There is 0 talk or chance of this happening. Kabul, Afganistan has just as good a shot as Milwaukee getting a team. Hartford has no arena and will not be getting one. The city is in awful financial shape. Hamilton isn't ever happening. A team in Hamilton would kill the Buffalo Sabres and put them out of business. Other than Winnipeg Buffalo is the smallest market in the league and the city population is actually declining. Buffalo is in awful financial shape being a rust belt city. By putting a team in Hamilton all you would be doing is helping one team and killing another. You'd be back to square one. Houston and Kansas city have the arenas to suport a team. However if a team went to KC it would be the smallest 3 team market team in the country. Houston has the size but would not have the interest. Quebec City would be the choice unless they screw up building a new arena. After seeing the total sucess story of Winnipeg selling out in 2 minutes Quebec City is the 1st choice. Bettman may not be the brightest but no way would he pick KC or Houston over QC. Indirectly you may have answered my argument. Buffalo is hurting, so too is Columbus, I listen to the news I know that the recession is hitting Ohio bad, and the civil service is under siege right now. Detroit is really hurting too from the recession. Moving a team from the East to the West as moving the Thrashers did, helps out at least one of these. Columbus and Detroit both want in the East, they are on the record saying this, as they are Eastern time zone teams forced to play 3 time zones away 8 times a year, 2 time zones away 8 times as well. That is an uncompetitive balance, for them and Vancouver, San Jose etc. If you move Phoenix to the East, you risk losing Columbus as a franchise as they will not be able to sustain the losses, and alienating Mike Ilitch, one of the most respected owners in the game. Divisional realignment will be an important factor. The Ottawa Sun is reporting that the NHL is already proposing realignment where both Columbus and Detroit move East, with the conferences going back to two divisions, likely making the Eastern Conference 16 teams. Quebec will not get a team until they have a new arena, the upgrades disclosed have nothing to do about being NHL ready. Le Colisée is no longer an NHL arena by NHL standards, no more than the Bradley Centre, Harford Civic Centre, etc, in fact less of one, similar to the old Winnipeg Arena. I want Québec to have a team, but I don't believe the speculation for an instant that Québec is guaranteed the Yotes. Bettman will go to Kansas City or Houston first, or Seattle if they can renovate the Key Centre to make it hockey friendly. If money talked, Basille would have a team, logic is still important, and logically Phoenix should stay in the West, though definitely not in Phoenix. I think the reason why they are playing an exhibition game in Houston this year is to gauge the fan support there. I found it interesting that the NHL said their were many suitors for the Coyotes, but Elaine Scruggs only knew of one, good ol' Husinger, who would probably move the team to KC first chance he had. For their record, I think Toronto-Hamilton-Buffalo could probably fare better than the New York Rangers-New York Isles-New Jersey if you were counting hockey fans, but that will be left into the hands of Long Island voters it seems. |
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Post by mikecubs on Jun 27, 2011 2:43:15 GMT -5
Realignment will not be a factor. Bettman will pick the best market period. Seattle has no chance whatso ever. They have no arena and no hopes of getting one approved for at least 10 years. Vegas has no arena and no hopes of getting one. Milwaukee has no arena. The Bradley Center is outdated. The Milwaukee Bucks want a new one. Milwaukee has only 1.5 Million people. No city under 2 million people has 3 teams in any sport. Plus they would have to compete with the Green Bay packers. I live in Wisconsin. There is 0 talk or chance of this happening. Kabul, Afganistan has just as good a shot as Milwaukee getting a team. Hartford has no arena and will not be getting one. The city is in awful financial shape. Hamilton isn't ever happening. A team in Hamilton would kill the Buffalo Sabres and put them out of business. Other than Winnipeg Buffalo is the smallest market in the league and the city population is actually declining. Buffalo is in awful financial shape being a rust belt city. By putting a team in Hamilton all you would be doing is helping one team and killing another. You'd be back to square one. Houston and Kansas city have the arenas to suport a team. However if a team went to KC it would be the smallest 3 team market team in the country. Houston has the size but would not have the interest. Quebec City would be the choice unless they screw up building a new arena. After seeing the total sucess story of Winnipeg selling out in 2 minutes Quebec City is the 1st choice. Bettman may not be the brightest but no way would he pick KC or Houston over QC. Indirectly you may have answered my argument. Buffalo is hurting, so too is Columbus, I listen to the news I know that the recession is hitting Ohio bad, and the civil service is under siege right now. Detroit is really hurting too from the recession. Moving a team from the East to the West as moving the Thrashers did, helps out at least one of these. Columbus and Detroit both want in the East, they are on the record saying this, as they are Eastern time zone teams forced to play 3 time zones away 8 times a year, 2 time zones away 8 times as well. That is an uncompetitive balance, for them and Vancouver, San Jose etc. If you move Phoenix to the East, you risk losing Columbus as a franchise as they will not be able to sustain the losses, and alienating Mike Ilitch, one of the most respected owners in the game. Divisional realignment will be an important factor. The Ottawa Sun is reporting that the NHL is already proposing realignment where both Columbus and Detroit move East, with the conferences going back to two divisions, likely making the Eastern Conference 16 teams. Quebec will not get a team until they have a new arena, the upgrades disclosed have nothing to do about being NHL ready. Le Colisée is no longer an NHL arena by NHL standards, no more than the Bradley Centre, Harford Civic Centre, etc, in fact less of one, similar to the old Winnipeg Arena. I want Québec to have a team, but I don't believe the speculation for an instant that Québec is guaranteed the Yotes. Bettman will go to Kansas City or Houston first, or Seattle if they can renovate the Key Centre to make it hockey friendly. If money talked, Basille would have a team, logic is still important, and logically Phoenix should stay in the West, though definitely not in Phoenix. I think the reason why they are playing an exhibition game in Houston this year is to gauge the fan support there. I found it interesting that the NHL said their were many suitors for the Coyotes, but Elaine Scruggs only knew of one, good ol' Husinger, who would probably move the team to KC first chance he had. For their record, I think Toronto-Hamilton-Buffalo could probably fare better than the New York Rangers-New York Isles-New Jersey if you were counting hockey fans, but that will be left into the hands of Long Island voters it seems. Your right about Ohio and Detroit also being hit hard by the economy. However moving Columbus east will not save them. The only thing that will save them is a new lease which is what they want www.fieldofschemes.com/news/archives/nhl/columbus_blue_jackets/I doubt Detroit will move east. No way does the NHL break up the Chicago/Detroit rivalry matter no how respected Illitch is. Having Detroit move east would cost the western teams a huge drawing card and leave the west with only one original 6 team. If they are going to go with 16 teams in the east move Columbus and Quebec City Read my post from above. I agree with you on the Colisee being outdated. A new arena is needed. No way could a team make it in the Colisee. Key Arena CANNOT be renovated for hockey. Thats how bad the design is. It can't be saved. The groups trying to bring a team there only talk of a new arena either in Bellview or Seattle. There is no movement at all right now in the Seattle area to build an arena. Former Seattle Supersonic fans wanted the state to extend the tax that paid for the football and baseball stadium to fund an arena and it was turned down this year. The Jim Basille thing is different than putting a team in Quebec City. The difference being putting a team in Quebec City is far away from any market. Putting a team in Hamilton affects the Maple Leafs and kills Buffalo. I could maybe see Houston or KC getting a team just because of the fact they do have nice arenas unlike Hartford,Seattle etc.. I really find it hard to believe anyone would go to KC. The Metro population is just over 2 Million. The town is a Kansas City Chiefs town 1st and foremost. The baseball Royals have the top farm system in the game coming into this season and most experts think by 2013/14 they will be a contender. I have a hard time seeing a team surviving. I didn't know Houston was having an exhibition game this year. Maybe if they have a good turn out it would be worth the try moving a team to Houston. Dallas has done a good job supporting the Stars. On Forbes list of franchise values the team was ranked 10th. Texas fans are quite loyal in other sports. Maybe it could work for hockey. I don't know. They certainly have the population and arena. I think the 3 New York teams would fair better than Toronto/Hamilton/Buffalo but only with a replacement for Nassau Coliseum. That building is the worst in the league by far. With a new building the Islanders can make it and all 3 teams will be fine. With a team in Hamilton Buffalo is done. Look at the population of New York compare Toronto/Hamilton/Buffalo. New York has 22 million people in its combined statistical area en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Table_of_United_States_Combined_Statistical_AreasToronto currently has around 5.7 million people. Hamilton is around 740,000. Buffalo has 1.1 million and going in reverse. The Greater Golden Horseshoe has 8.1 million residents total as of 2006. en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Golden_HorseshoeNew York is just way bigger. |
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