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Post by cougar222 on Apr 4, 2011 19:18:31 GMT -5
I don't know his publication, but this is a columnist who supports COG in their stand with the Coyotes, it doesn't seem to be a blog, and this is ArizonaSports.com, not a newspaper, so not sure if it belongs in the media/news section or in the blog section, but put it wherever you like. He is making interesting points. First I ever heard about the Yotes donating to charity. This still speaks of desperation to me: "Over the last week I've been called an uneducated, illiterate, underachieving, �Yotestard' who is a liar and only has a GED because of my support of the City of Glendale's plan to give potential Coyotes owner Matthew Hulsizer $100 million in exchange for parking rights. The issue for me is, it doesn't take intelligence to see how this is the right deal for the city, taxpayers and the team. It takes common sense. If you believe the estimate that Glendale mayor Elaine Scruggs presented, the city stands to lose up to $500 million over the next 30 years if the Coyotes were to relocate. That's a huge number when you consider the $180 million investment the city made in building Jobing.com Arena to begin with. Detractors will argue that number has been grossly inflated by politicians trying to justify another risky move. Well, here are a few numbers that can't be argued with no matter how much some people may try. If the team packs up the trucks and moves north, there are 860 people who stand to lose their jobs (500 employed at the Jobing.com Arena, 250 Aramark employees (concession) and 110 who work directly for the team). That doesn't even include the other stores and restaurants at Westgate that may close due to their departure. These people are tax payers and spend money in the city. Who's watching out for them and their needs? Where's their watchdog group? Not enough for you? How about the $350,000 a year the Coyotes Charities donate each year to those in need around the state? They've donated $2.2 million to charities around the Valley since 2001. Will any of the bond detractors pick up the tab and help those in need if the team heads back the Great White North? I highly doubt it. " Read more at: arizonasports.com/category/espo-blogs/20110404/Espo:-Simple-math-proves-Goldwater-Institute-is-wrong-on-Phoenix-Coyotes/ |
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Post by gobombersgo on Apr 4, 2011 19:21:15 GMT -5
It may very well be the right deal for the city. To bad is it illegal and against the law. I also don't see any simple math here??
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Post by glenman2001 on Apr 4, 2011 19:24:29 GMT -5
It may very well be the right deal for the city. To bad is it illegal and against the law. I also don't see any simple math here?? Exactly. That like saying I robbed a bank and then gave all the money to the united way. Good intentions, but I think i'll still be going to jail. |
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Post by dandeneau44 on Apr 4, 2011 19:24:42 GMT -5
I still don't see any hard evidence to back up this 500 million dollar claim. Oh and he seems to forget that bonds have this funny thing called interest. His opinion changes nothing, oh and he used the word irregardless [sic]...not a word at all. It's regardless. All in all i don't think he's done his homework on this too well. He's just trying to make it sound like the end of the world if the Coyotes leave just like the rest of their supporters.
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Post by andykat on Apr 4, 2011 19:30:38 GMT -5
An opinion on a site affiliated to a talk radio station in AZ.
And I've caught a few of Espo's tweets in the past.
Meh....next!
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Post by ducky75 on Apr 4, 2011 19:35:34 GMT -5
"Irregardless, it's not looking out for the best interest of anyone but themselves (especially when they use dirty tactics like calling up potential bond investors and scaring them away). "
If this guy is an actual employed journalist and still using that word, my industry is in worse shape than I thought.
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Post by Puckschmuck on Apr 4, 2011 19:37:01 GMT -5
DESPERATION COMING FROM THE DESERT, FOLKS!  |
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Post by andykat on Apr 4, 2011 19:37:29 GMT -5
More like a paid blogger....perhaps an on-air Sports Guy....
....which is a different life form than "journalist".
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piddy
Veteran Member
Posts: 188
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Post by piddy on Apr 4, 2011 19:41:09 GMT -5
It's funny to me that they report losing the Coyotes will cost this much. It's as if they expect the Jobing.com arena to sit completely vacant. What about filling 44 dates with a minor league team...or motocross and monster trucks. 250 Aramark employees will lose their jobs? If the arena is still operating that won't be the case. If Glendale doesn't fill the dates left empty by the coyotes it's still only 44 days of work...if not only a few hours per game. Crappy to anyone lose their job but the concession jobs don't do a whole lot for the Glendale economy...let's be real. Same goes for many who work at the arena and Westgate...if they put something in the arena...jobs will still be there. Maybe not as many...but it definitley wouldn't be a ghost town full of tumbleweed.
I found it funny that the author goes on to talk about the Coyotes donating to charities in the state when in fact the City of Glendale would have WAY more money to spend on charity without the Coyotes. Coyotes give to charity...Glendale gives to Coyotes (via proposed deal). Crap CoG...just cut out the middle man and give 350 000 a year to charity yourselves...would save you MILLIONS.
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Post by littlegeneral04 on Apr 4, 2011 19:42:18 GMT -5
If the team packs up the trucks and moves north, there are 860 people who stand to lose their jobs (500 employed at the Jobing.com Arena, 250 Aramark employees (concession) and 110 who work directly for the team).
Who is this guy kidding? The only jobs that are affected are the 110 that work for the Yotes and even some of them will be given options to move with the Team. I guess jobing.com will now close so there will be no need for concessions staff as it will be self serve I guess.... What a crock!
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Post by chootem on Apr 4, 2011 19:44:55 GMT -5
no simple math.......just bias opinion.....IMO.He is assuming that they will never find another tenant for the building.Highly unlikely.There are many other cheaper options for Jobbing.
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Post by jetsorbust on Apr 4, 2011 19:49:13 GMT -5
Bush league article, it just cherry picks a couple of good things about the Coyotes.
As everyone has pointed out, it still doesn't show that overall it's worth $197 Million plus interest to keep the Coyotes there, nor does even begin to dispute the claim that $500 Million is grossly inflated!
If there are 750 (500 by jobing.com, 250 by Aramark according to the article) jobs that are going to be lost as a result of the Coyotes leaving, then it's important to mention these are PART TIME JOBS!
41 games a year, maybe 45 on average with pre-season games and playoffs (there's maybe 750 fans at a pre-season game... so I can't see it paying the bills for 750 employees). That does not equate to 750 full time jobs, it just doesn't.
So as far as simple math or proving anything goes... EPIC FAIL!
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Post by Grumpz on Apr 4, 2011 19:49:55 GMT -5
"Irregardless, it's not looking out for the best interest of anyone but themselves (especially when they use dirty tactics like calling up potential bond investors and scaring them away). " If this guy is an actual employed journalist and still using that word, my industry is in worse shape than I thought. Yes! Irregardless is right up their with "pre-warn". |
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Post by StaticPrevails on Apr 4, 2011 19:53:04 GMT -5
Stopped reading there.
Sorry guy, I understand jobs may be lost, but unfortunately that's what happens when a business isn't making money.
I still can't fathom how all these clowns try to justify keeping the team because it's good for the local economy or employees livelihoods are at stake.
The bottom line is that THIS TEAM ISN'T MAKING A PROFIT. This can be solely attributed to the fact that there isn't enough interest in hockey down there to support a team. It's not because of poor management or bad on-ice performance, NOBODY CARES ABOUT HOCKEY IN THE DESERT.
The obvious reason why the team is leaving seems to be the one thing these boneheads are always overlooking. They've had 15 years to get their shit together, 8 of those years in beautiful, state of the art arena, and they still can't draw more fans than a wheat kings game most of the time.
You've had your chance Jokedale, now it's ours again.
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piddy
Veteran Member
Posts: 188
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Post by piddy on Apr 4, 2011 19:53:37 GMT -5
"These people are tax payers and spend money in the city. Who's watching out for them and their needs? Where's their watchdog group?"
It's called Goldwater...they're trying to protect Glendale citizens. I mean they could back off and let you keep the team so a few thousand fans can go and enjoy the games. If they did though, I think the CoG would have a hard time paying for certain things...like firefighters, police, public works, recreation centres etc
"Oh crap my house is burning where's the firefighters?"
"Yeah...about that...we kept the Coyotes so we don't have enough firefighters right now. But how about those Yotes??"
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Post by jetsorbust on Apr 4, 2011 19:54:09 GMT -5
It's funny to me that they report losing the Coyotes will cost this much. It's as if they expect the Jobing.com arena to sit completely vacant. What about filling 44 dates with a minor league team...or motocross and monster trucks. 250 Aramark employees will lose their jobs? If the arena is still operating that won't be the case. If Glendale doesn't fill the dates left empty by the coyotes it's still only 44 days of work...if not only a few hours per game. Crappy to anyone lose their job but the concession jobs don't do a whole lot for the Glendale economy...let's be real. Same goes for many who work at the arena and Westgate...if they put something in the arena...jobs will still be there. Maybe not as many...but it definitley wouldn't be a ghost town full of tumbleweed. I found it funny that the author goes on to talk about the Coyotes donating to charities in the state when in fact the City of Glendale would have WAY more money to spend on charity without the Coyotes. Coyotes give to charity...Glendale gives to Coyotes (via proposed deal). Crap CoG... just cut out the middle man and give 350 000 a year to charity yourselves...would save you MILLIONS.Exactly. Not only does this article not prove anything, or even use math (as the title suggests), but it just cherry picks a few statistics that don't mean much in the long-run... and even those statistics can be easily shown to be crap! (i.e. Jobs lost could only possibly be 41-45 days a year lost, giving to charity is erroneous when the company needs public funding and gives only a fraction to charity compared to what the public has to give, etc) |
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Post by awal47 on Apr 4, 2011 19:58:27 GMT -5
I don't think that anyone has ever questioned whether or not there would be a negative impact on Glendale if (eventually when) the Coyotes leave. Any failing business leaves a hole when it finally fails completely. However, the math that the author is using here is a little too simple. Most of those jobs aren't full time, most of them are minimum wage (or thereabouts), and you'd have a very difficult time convincing me that the economic value of those jobs could ever approach $500 million over thirty years, or that they've been worth the roughly $400 million that the Coyotes have lost over the past sixteen years.
It will be unfortunate for Glendale, and for the Coyotes' fans when that team ultimately leaves (whether it's now or 5 years from now when Hulsizer loses all his money, they will leave), but that's the unfortunate price of trying to shoehorn a product into a market with no support.
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Post by mstngs84 on Apr 4, 2011 20:15:14 GMT -5
what kind of job works 3-4 hours per day for 40-45 days a year
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Post by Puckschmuck on Apr 4, 2011 20:21:22 GMT -5
You know what else is simple math? 15 years of consecutive annual losses totaling over 300 million dollars.
Pretty simple, eh?
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Post by Guardian on Apr 4, 2011 20:23:03 GMT -5
^^Exactly!
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